298: Pacing Your Race - AUDIO ONLY
[00:00:00] Angie: This is the real life runners podcast, episode number 298. Pacing your race. Today, we're talking about how not all races have to be about performance. There are multiple reasons you can run a race and each of those should be approached differently. Unfortunately, we see so many runners think that every race they run, it needs to be an attempt at a PR and they feel disappointed when they don't set a new, personal record at every race.
That can really suck the joy out of running pretty quickly. So today we want to talk about several purposes behind races. And how to pace each one for success and the most satisfaction. So if that sounds interesting, stay tuned. [00:01:00]
All right, so today we're talking about pacing and how to pace for different types of races, and before we jump into some of the training that we wanna talk about today, it's important for you to get clear on why you're running a race in the first place. And this is one of the things I don't think a lot of runners even realize that there are different purposes, or that there can be different purposes for running a race.
[00:01:33] Kevin: It just, it reminds me of Rocky, the one with Mr. T in it. Okay. Do you have any predictions for the, do you have any predictions for the fight? And he just looks at the reporter and goes, Pain . Why does that remind you of it? Because so many people go into a race and that's what they have in their mind. I'm gonna push myself really, really hard.
This is gonna be incredibly uncomfortable because it's a race and that's, that's what a race is supposed to be, is just super, super uncomfortable. Yeah. But there's so many reasons that [00:02:00] you could race. Mm-hmm. and many of them don't have anything to do with physical pain at all. Um, don't they? , are you sure?
Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, quite, I'm quite confident in that one. .
[00:02:10] Angie: So that's the thing that, you know, we wanna really kind of dig into today is number one, there are different purposes for racing. You don't have to race in order to get a PR every time. And I think that's one of the biggest mistakes that we see so many runners making is thinking that they have to run a race or they have to pr if they run a race or that it's not worth signing up for a race if you're not trying to
[00:02:34] Kevin: pr.
Right? Like you don't have to pr Yeah. But you have to at least be trying for one. Mm-hmm. , that you gotta be given it a, a good, solid shot of trying to run the fastest that you've ever run in your life at that particular distance, which seems tiring,
[00:02:46] Angie: it seems tiring, and it can really quickly suck a lot of the joy out of running.
So today, let's talk about three. Reasons that you might run a race three different purposes for races. And then we're gonna talk about [00:03:00] pacing for those different purposes, because that's really the first step is understanding why you're running a race in the first place. You know, are you trying to see how you're going to perform?
Are you trying to set a personal record? Are you running a race just for fun? Are you running a race in preparation for another race? Like those are the three main categories that we're going to talk about today. So let's talk about first the fact that you can run a race for fun. Races can just be for fun and for the
[00:03:28] Kevin: experience.
Yes, which makes pacing that race. By the way, the, the title of this really is Pacing and Racing. Pacing and Racing, or Racing and Pacing. I don't know. Either way it rhymes and that's fantastic. Um, , but the whole idea that you could run and just enjoy the entire thing, start to finish. And if it feels uncomfortable, you could slow down.
You could take a walking break mm-hmm. and just actually enjoy every bit of the experience. Yeah. For a long time was completely beyond my mental capacity. It was [00:04:00] beyond me
[00:04:00] Angie: too, until I did it. And then it was amazing. It was amazing. Yeah. So this was one, one of the mistakes that I for sure fell into, especially at the beginning of my running career.
But I still find myself going, like, falling into this mentality. So I'm, we're gonna talk about this today, but I want you guys to also know that just because we're talking about it, and just because we can explain this to you, does not mean that we have this a hundred percent mastered either. Like, I still find myself falling into some of these traps because I'm still a runner, right.
And I ca I catch myself , and I can pull myself out of them much more quickly. But like, . Our brains sometimes are just so funny, like thinking like, why would I sign up for a race? Why would I spend money? Yep. On a race to just go out and run for fun and. Why would I do that and not try to pr? And I think that this is one of the big things that a lot of runners do is that they just try to PR at every race.
And that just leads to so much disappointment and frustration. So just knowing that races can be just for fun is something [00:05:00] that can really lighten the load and lighten the pressure. on races because I think so many people put so much pressure on themselves Yeah. Totally. To perform at a race. They're like, well, if I'm putting a, a bib on my chest or on my stomach, um, I need to go out there and I need to do my best and I need to give my best and push my hardest.
And it doesn't have to be that way. And we are giving you permission, not that you need it. Right. Especially not from us, but you have permission to just go out and have a good time. And just have fun at a race. Like you don't have to race every race. You don't have to go out and try to get your best time ever.
Every single race that you run, just because you have a number on your chest does not mean that you have to go out and push yourself until you feel like you need to, you know, lie down as soon as you cross the finish line. Yeah.
[00:05:44] Kevin: Every race does not have to be followed by life. Three days, maybe three weeks of recovery.
Mm-hmm. , like you could go out and just enjoy the thing. Yeah. And then slide right back into your normal running routine. Mm-hmm. like it's completely fine. And some people are like, well, how would I ever just put a [00:06:00] fun race on the weekend? That's when my long run goes, and then my training plan is completely thrown out the window.
No, no it's not. Yeah. It's just gonna be a fun thing you're gonna do on the weekend. It's gonna be great. It's gonna kinda mix up your whole training schedule thing because you're just doing something fun on the weekend. Mm-hmm. where you get to enjoy the running community. You don't have to grind the other runners in the community into the ground and try out, kick them and throw elbows like you, you don't, you can just go out and enjoy the whole thing.
I don't think most people do that anyway. Just you, I was kinda looking at you really . Huh. Either way. Um, but, but the, you can, you can just go out and enjoy the whole community. Yeah. There are some of the five Ks that we used to do when, back when we raced a little more often. It's kind of gotten out of our racing routine.
But there were some races that, it didn't matter which one it was, there were a few guys in the local running community, they were at every single race. Mm-hmm. , like, there are a few people that definitely show up at every [00:07:00] single race they possibly can. Unfortunately,
[00:07:01] Angie: one of them used to wear a Speedo Yeah.
And
[00:07:04] Kevin: tuck a water bottle in the back of it. That was not a good look. But there are a few guys that if it's in our county Yeah. Like if it's anywhere in the county, they're gonna show up at it. Mm-hmm. . And, and that's because they, they have fun with it and then they Right. They're one of the last people leaving the like post run festivities.
Mm-hmm. also. Mm-hmm. . Yeah.
[00:07:21] Angie: Because they just really enjoy it. And I think that this was, um, like for me, like one of the first times that I did this was. When I took a girls' trip out to Napa Valley, like my friends and I decided for one of our friends' birthdays, it was her 40th birthday, we were gonna go out and we were gonna run the Napa to Sonoma half marathon.
Yep. Which was so much fun. And I was training for this and. , you know? So I trained for it. I did long runs and I followed a training plan and everything like that. But I decided ahead of time that on race day I was just going to go out and enjoy the experience. Right. And I was going to run the race with my friends, regardless of what that pace [00:08:00] was like.
I didn't care if we wanted to stop along the way. I didn't care if we wanted to slow down along the way. Like the time on the clock did not matter to me at all, because we heard that they were supposed to be wine along the course, along the course, right? And I was like, well, how fun would that be? You know, like to do wine tastings as I'm running a half marathon.
Like I wonder how my body's gonna respond to that.
[00:08:20] Kevin: Right. Every marathon I've ever, yeah. I've ever run has beer tastings along the course. They're not really technically part of the course as much as it's a dude at the end of his driveway with a cooler, but still beer tasting, I
[00:08:29] Angie: think. Beer tasting. Yeah.
And it's so funny because, you know, like in that race, we actually had to stop for like a train or traffic like. And we thank goodness I wasn't, I didn't care about the time. Right. Because that took about two minutes off of, um, our, our time. We were just literally standing there waiting for traffic, waiting for the train traffic, the train to pass by.
Um, so, but the people that were racing that race were getting really, really mad.
[00:08:54] Kevin: I bet. Because you were really mad. Awfully close to the
[00:08:56] Angie: two hour I was right at, yeah, because I ran like a 2 0 1. Right. [00:09:00] So that two minutes would've put us sub two. So everybody else around us was running that pace as
[00:09:04] Kevin: well.
Right. Who were who, some of whom Yeah. Were actively trying to probably break two hours for maybe the first time ever. Right. And then a train shows up in front of us, not
[00:09:13] Angie: cool. Right. But for me it was totally fine and was like, oh, this is a nice little break here. Like, let's just hang out with you . Right.
And we found some alpacas along the way and we stopped and took pictures with alpacas and it was just so fun. And it was, it's really one of my favorite. Half marathon memories. And I did wanna, you know, I did the whole thing, like side by side with a, a good friend of mine and it was just so much fun to just be out in Napa Valley, like the scenery, the rolling hills, the vineyards.
It was so gorgeous. And just being able to enjoy all of that made that run so worthwhile, even though I didn't hit a PR in that race.
[00:09:47] Kevin: Right. One. , but you had decided beforehand Yeah. That it was going to be for pure enjoyment. Mm-hmm. because you were with a group. Mm-hmm. like I think that's one of the things that helps you sort of make sure that you're focusing [00:10:00] on the fun aspect.
Yeah. Is you wanted to stay with your group the entire time, so if it slowed down a little bit, you were going to stay with your group and it made sure that you weren't worried at all about the clock. Yeah. Sometimes if you're coming back from like an injury or an illness and you're like, well, I've signed up for this race, I'm just going, but I'm definitely not in shape to even attempt running a personal record at it.
Mm-hmm. , why don't I just go enjoy the experience
[00:10:22] Angie: a whole heck of a lot. Yeah. Well, and it's funny because this, that shows like the example that I just gave really does show how I have. Progressed in my thinking because I used to look at people that ran Disney. Yep. I think Disney is a great example's.
Wonderful as well, right? All of the Disney races, there are character stops along the way where people stop and take pictures. And I remember when I first got into running and first got into racing, seeing these pictures of girls in my running group that would go run Disney and they'd have all of these pictures with all the characters, and I'm like, what the heck are they doing?
They do. Why would they stop for a photo? Do they understand how much that [00:11:00] time that's taking off of their time? And yeah, they probably did. They just didn't care because to them it was about the experience. It wasn't about the time on the clock, it was about going out. Running through Disney, enjoying all of that.
Taking the character stops. Like there's lines. There's lines like you, it's not just like, oh, you pop in and like take a photo and then keep running. Like there's a line you wait for the character stops for like five to 10 minutes for some of them, depending on which character it is. And so for them, it's not about the time, it's about the experience,
[00:11:28] Kevin: which I think it makes for so much fun.
Yeah. But you need something that makes the experience worthwhile. Mm-hmm. . So running with a group, being able at like Disney that you get the character stops. Yeah. There's a few that are just like gorgeous scenic races. Mm-hmm. being in Florida, we, there's a few races around us that get named the list of like top sunrise, marathons.
Mm-hmm. or half marathons. Um, there's a beautiful course out in California where I came from that you have to run up. Awful. Awful hill . But at the top of it is a dude in a tuxedo [00:12:00] and a grand piano playing. Oh, at Big Sir. At Big Sir. Mm-hmm. . So people will stop and take pictures with their group and the guy with the piano.
That's phenomenal. Yeah. It's
[00:12:09] Angie: Oh, the same thing at the Key West Half Marathon. Like there were so many people that were stopping and taking pictures with the Southern place at Southern Point Point
[00:12:15] Kevin: Yeah. Of the United States. Yeah. I don't really even remember going past that at I was, I was not doing that one for pure fun
I had a blast doing it. Yeah. But I was definitely not that this, which is the other thing is some of these different categories you're putting into can blend together. They can, but when you're going just for pure fun, the clock doesn't matter. There are a few things. So a group really enjoying the, the surroundings.
I think a relay. Mm-hmm. that kinda like takes you out of your normal race thing. Yeah. Especially if you have a relay where different people in the, on your group are at different abilities. Like, um, that, that can be like, all right, well, I'm gonna run as fast as I can, but then I'm handing it off to this person and I'm, I have no control over how fast they're going or theme races.
Mm-hmm. where if you're in a costume, you're gonna [00:13:00] have more
[00:13:00] Angie: fun. Yeah. So there's lots of reasons that you can just go out and run to have fun or just to enjoy the experience. And so if you're trying to pace those races, there's not really a pacing strategy that you need to worry about. The pace should probably be easy most of the time.
Like L two, L three is a great way to run a race like that. If you wanna push yourself a little bit during the race, go for it. If that seems fun to you. Go for it. But there's not really like a quote unquote pacing strategy that we would suggest if you're just going out to
[00:13:30] Kevin: run for fun. Yeah. And if you're doing a trail race and it's got ups and downs and crazy hills and climbs.
Yeah. And you're like, you know what would be fun? It's a short hill. Let's see if I push up this hill. No, not at all. Why don't I walk up this hill? But the downhill looks like fun. Maybe you enjoy the heck out of running fast downhill. Walk the ups and just fly down the downhill. Yeah. Bomb the downhills as they like to say.
Yeah,
[00:13:51] Angie: exactly. So there's lots of different ways that you can do it. So find something that seems fun for you and maybe make running like kind of like what you were just saying with those [00:14:00] trails. That's kind of like running like a kid would. Yeah. You know, go kind of get back into your kid days and your kid mentality of like just going out and running for fun.
Remember when you were a kid and you used to run everywhere? Of course you do. Just because like to get from here to there, we run, we don't walk, we run because we run. You're a kid, you're what, five years
[00:14:18] Kevin: old? Of course. And if you're running down a hill, you're clearly going to put your arms out to the sides because then it's like you're flying and that's just gonna be
[00:14:25] Angie: inherently more fun also.
Sounds like a plan. All right. The second reason or purpose of a run or, or of a race. Could be in preparation for another race. Okay? So you can run a race in order to prepare for a bigger goal race. And this is one of the categories that I think often gets forgotten. Like a lot of people are like, yeah, I wanna run a race for fun or for the experience.
Yep. Or I wanna run a race for performance. I wanna race a race to see how well I can do. But a lot of people forget this middle one of you can run a race in preparation for another race [00:15:00] as kind of a a time trial, kind of a checkpoint Along the way you can run it and use that race to practice certain things for your bigger goal race.
But when people do this, when they put a race into the middle of a training cycle, so say you are training for a half marathon or a marathon, And you decide you're gonna put another race in, in that, you know, 12 week block or 16 week block. Sure. The biggest mistake people make here is trying to race that race before the goal race , just to see if I can do it right.
Yeah. And this is one of the reasons that people all the time ask, well, if I'm gonna run a marathon, why wouldn't I run a marathon in training for a marathon? Why do I only get up to 18 miles or 16 miles? Why? Like, how am I, how do I know that I can do that last six miles? And that's a simple answer. You're just going to do it.
Yep. Like, that's just what it is. Right. But understanding that you don't have to run a race [00:16:00] before your goal race just to prove that you can do it. Because the two things often happen here, number one. There's a lot of disappointment that can happen because you're not peaked for that race, right? You're training.
So say you run a race that you know, six or eight weeks into your training cycle and you've got a 12 week train cycle, then you're not primed for that race yet. You're primed for it at the end of the 12 week period. So people get disappointed over their performance in that race, and then, Causes them to lose confidence.
Yep. For the goal race. Yep. So you're really doing yourself a major
[00:16:35] Kevin: disservice. Yeah. You have the preparation race, except you forget that it's a preparation race. Right. And you decide as soon as they shoot off the gun, this is your PR race. Mm-hmm. , but you're not prepared for to be your PR race. Right.
Maybe you didn't taper for it. You certainly don't have the final like four to six weeks of training. Mm-hmm. that that is still building up. That is the peak four. The goal race, the peak weeks. Yes. Yeah. Like you might be just [00:17:00] entering the highest mileage depending on how the, how the plan works. Maybe you've been in high mileage, so your legs are actually really tired.
Going into this prep race, so there's like no chance of preparing for it. Maybe you didn't taper at all and it's a longer race. Mm-hmm. Like that's just not setting you up for pr. It's setting you up to practice some of the things that will come up during race day. It's not setting you up for a pr. And a lot of people try to combine this one of like, oh, I'm gonna do this as a prep work, but I also kind of sort of want a PR Yeah.
At setting yourself
[00:17:30] Angie: up for disappointment. Right. Or what happens is, , you peak too soon before the goal race. So people that are like, yeah, yeah, I'm gonna put this race in here. Yep. But then I'm actually, I actually do care what my time is. So I am gonna actually taper three, three weeks before this, this race and then try to race it, even though this isn't technically my goal race.
So what can happen is that you peak too soon before your goal race, and then you don't give yourself enough recovery for your goal race. Or maybe you put [00:18:00] that race too close to that goal race. Yeah. Maybe you put it, you know, two weeks before and you don't actually give yourself enough time to recover and allow your body to.
um, you know, recover fully before actually trying to hit that goal race. And so, you know, that can lead to just a ton of frustration, a a lot of loss of confidence, um, in, in the process in yourself, in why you're doing all of this in the first place. So if you're going to use a race in preparation for another race, number one, this is a great idea, okay?
There's just ways that you can do it that make it more effective and that make it a heck of a. More enjoyable too. Okay. So the first thing you can do is use this as a time trial or checkpoint before a bigger goal race. So usually wh when you're doing a time trial or a um, a checkpoint race, you're gonna wanna choose a race distance that is shorter than your goal race.
So, for example, if you are training for a marathon, maybe you wanna [00:19:00] run a half marathon in training for the full marathon, you maybe wanna sign up for a half marathon about halfway through your cycle. Sure. Fantastic. Maybe you're training for a half marathon. A great checkpoint race would be a 10 K in that case because it's about half the distance of that half marathon.
And you can use it to kind of check in and see where, where your pace is, and that will help you to better plan your pacing strategy for race day as well.
[00:19:27] Kevin: Yeah, a hundred percent. Like one of the things that I like to do, um, is as I get near. Thank you. As I get near the, uh, the, the race itself, maybe a few weeks out, have like a much longer workout.
Like instead of a long run over the weekend, I'll do like a really long, pretty intense volume workout. Yeah. Instead of that, you can run a race, like instead of the, the big workout heading into your marathon, you could literally run a half marathon. A half marathon is a [00:20:00] great prep for a marathon. Mm-hmm. , A 10 K is a great prep for a half marathon.
Like they're really good workouts in and of themselves, so if it fits the schedule mm-hmm. then put the race in, especially if you enjoy the aspect of racing. And here's the thing, if racing is super stressful for. adding this race in instead of like, like a longer workout prep may be a benefit because you kinda get used to the, the nerves of race day.
Mm-hmm. without the, the pressure of this being like your goal race. Yeah. It also, it might be too stressful for you and maybe this is a bad idea. Yeah. So
[00:20:32] Angie: you have to see how you respond to this for sure. Right. Um, and if you want to. A race, as you know, in preparation for another race. If you choose a race that's shorter, you can definitely race it.
You know, that is part of the goal of this time trial or checkpoint. You go out and you actually race this race. So what we were talking about before where. You don't wanna race the race before your goal race. That's if you are doing the same distance of [00:21:00] the goal race. Yeah. It's if you're running
[00:21:01] Kevin: a half marathon in preparation for a half
[00:21:03] Angie: marathon.
Right. You don't wanna race a half marathon before your goal half marathon.
[00:21:07] Kevin: Right. If you're knocking out a 10 k a month out from your half marathon, yeah. You are going for it. Yeah. Because you have a month to recover, go for it. Like you were really pushing this thing. Right.
[00:21:15] Angie: So you wanna plan this time trial race about three to six weeks before your goal race, depending on the recovery needed.
Okay. So the longer your race, the more recovery you're gonna want. Mm-hmm. , you know, in between this checkpoint race and your goal race. So if you're training for a, a full marathon and you decide that you're gonna race a half in preparation, you wanna be more on the four to six weeks end of it. Whereas if you're doing a 10 K in prep for a half marathon, you could probably push it to like three
[00:21:43] Kevin: weeks.
Right. It also depends on what like your overall volume is. Yeah. . Like if, if you're gonna really push a half marathon, but you're used to on a regular basis running the upper teens, like if your long run is up to 20 ish, if you're gonna push [00:22:00] 13, you're gonna be tired. Mm-hmm. , you're gonna take a few days to be fully like recovered from that.
Yeah. But it's not gonna like crush you if you're training for a marathon and running 13 is exhausting racing, 13 is gonna be super exhausting. So you're gonna need to push that further out.
[00:22:15] Angie: Exactly. So you can definitely use this as that time trial that will help you to understand what. Your goal pace for your upcoming race Could be.
Yes. So, so can you talk a little bit about how to use your race results in order to determine your pacing strategy or your pacing range of what kind of what you're
[00:22:34] Kevin: going for? Sure. So in general there, there's some formulas that suggest that as you race longer, you're obviously going to slow down. So as you go from like a 10 K to a half marathon mm-hmm.
it's not going to be the same pace, it's going to be a little bit slower. I think it's like 4% every time the distance doubles. Mm-hmm. is something roughly to that effect. so you can kind of judge of if I'm pushing, there's formulas all over the internet. I'm sure you can
[00:22:58] Angie: find, yeah. You can find
[00:22:59] Kevin: a PACE calculator.
[00:23:00] There's, that's the thing, like if you literally type in race pace calculator mm-hmm. , you don't want one that says, I ran this for a 10 K. If I maintained that pace, what would it be for my half? Cuz you're gonna slow down. You want one that, that's very nice. It'll say, I ran this for a 10 k predict my half marathon or the reverse.
My goal is this for a half marathon. Mm-hmm What should I be aiming for for a 10 K? And it'll give you a good idea of, are you in the ballpark for
[00:23:27] Angie: this? Mm-hmm. That's a good way too. Yeah. Yeah. That's a really good way to use a pace calculator
[00:23:30] Kevin: it that there's one of the things that, that the. Like the shorter distance races help prep you for of, if, if you're trying to run, let's do like a much shorter thing if you're trying to run say, a 5K in 18 minutes, so like six minute pace mm-hmm.
and you go off and you run a mile in six and you have to lay on the ground afterwards. Yeah. You're 18 minute 5K is not a good idea. Right. But you didn't get your fast, fast pace. quick enough. So [00:24:00] this kinda happens even as you go towards, towards longer distances. Mm-hmm. , it's gonna be awfully hard to break four hours in the marathon if you can't break two hours in a half marathon.
They all kind of, mm-hmm. , you know, they domino towards each other.
[00:24:13] Angie: Right. So once you have that checkpoint race, you can then use, or maybe say, say you already kind of know, maybe this is not your first race, it's not the first time, you know, you've run this distance or raced this distance. So you've had past races and.
An idea of what you are capable of. Um, make sure it is a race that is relatively, um, recent. You know, we don't wanna base your pacing strategy on a race that you did five years ago or really even a year or two ago, because your life now could be look very different than your life a year or two ago. So it is good to do these checkpoint races to kind of get an idea of where you are right now in this current training cycle.
Um, but another reason that you could use a race to prepare for another race would be to [00:25:00] practice a pacing strategy. So there are a couple different types of pacing strategies out there. But two of the big ones are even splits and negative splits. Okay. So even splits means that you try to, you have your goal pace and you try to hit that pace throughout the entire race.
You know, every mile split is basically the same. That would be even splitting the race. A negative split means that you start the race slower and you try to make each mile faster as you go along.
[00:25:29] Kevin: Right. And I mean, those are two really good strategies as we get into the third concept of like racing for prs.
Mm-hmm. , I think we'll dive a little bit more into the details of all your different pacing strategies, but practicing a pacing strategy. Mm-hmm. in your practice race seems like an awful good idea for practice racing. Right. You can also practice fueling strategies. Yes. Okay. And Angie has a wonderful story that she has definitely not shared on the podcast yet about I have.
So many times the difference between fueling during an easy run mm-hmm. [00:26:00] and being like, yes, I a hundred percent can eat raisins and they're delicious on my fuel. I can mm-hmm. I can work this, my stomach is okay with them at an easy pace, and then suddenly you're at race pace and still trying to put raisins into your mouth and they're the worst things ever because they're, because you can't chew
[00:26:18] Angie: them.
Yeah. I mean, you can, I just didn't want to , I wanted to spit those darn things out. . Being able to practice your fueling strategy while running at a harder pace is a fantastic reason to do a race. In preparation for a goal
[00:26:32] Kevin: race, you have the raisin issue. Yeah. And which I totally agree with. Like sometimes things that seem kind of chewy out on like an easy run.
You're like, I can totally handle this. Because when you're chewing, you briefly have to breathe through your nose. Mm-hmm. . But when you're racing, you're not doing a whole lot of breathing through your nose. You're kind of racing pretty hard. . So it's possible that anything that involves a lot of chewing is not gonna work real great for you.
Yeah. Um, but the other thing is, it's possible that at slower paces, your stomach has no [00:27:00] issues. Mm-hmm. with certain foods mm-hmm. and suddenly they become sloshy and not digestible. Right. At faster paces, the faster you go, the less your body likes to digest food. Mm-hmm. because it's too busy diverting blood to like your legs so that you can keep running so fast.
So it's a good idea to practice your fueling strategy at an actual race pace to make sure that your body can actually digest your fueling strategy. Right.
[00:27:22] Angie: And so you don't have to do that in a race. You can do that in one of your harder workouts, you know, during your true, any day of the week. Very true.
Why not use one of your races to do this? I know like we had a client that did this. She ran a half marathon in preparation for her full marathon and the whole goal of the half marathon was fueling. Yep. That was it. Like she didn't care about pace or time or any of that. The only goal was fueling and she ended up actually running a PR in the process.
Of course she did. Which is so fun, right? Which is like, um, a perfect example of what we've talked about so many times of when you don't focus on the PR and you focus on other things that you can control. Because you [00:28:00] can't control whether or not you run the pr, you can only control some of the variables that go along.
You can control your fueling, you can control your effort level, you can control, you know, how hard you push your hydration. All of that. . So by focusing on that, she came out with a pr, which I love to see that happen.
[00:28:16] Kevin: Right? It took the stress away from the race because the only goal was fueling, fueling generally leads to better results.
Yeah. And ta pr. Pr.
[00:28:24] Angie: So, so yeah. So that's another reason that you can use a race to prepare for another race. And finally, um, it can just help break up the boredom of a training cycle for people who love to race. Because there are people out there, and you might be one of them listening to this podcast that just love racing.
You know? So maybe you don't wanna just go out and, and run a race just for fun in the middle of a training cycle. Maybe you want that race to also be for fun, be for the community, be for that, but also, Get something out of that. Get something else out of the race other than just fun. Um, so it can help you to prepare, you know, [00:29:00] by using one of these other reasons, um, and just get you back out into the racing community.
And just, um, you know, actually another thing too is that if you've never raced before, doing a tuneup race before your goal race can be really helpful as well because it can expose you to the racing environment. Yes. You know, to understanding like how, you know, um, how far in advance should I get there?
You know,
[00:29:23] Kevin: if the race is at eight, do I need to get there at eight? No, you do not. You need to get there before eight.
[00:29:28] Angie: Yeah, definitely get there before eight. Um, but like, just kind of. Introduce you to the race environment in a, a lower pressure situation. That's not your goal race, but just can help you feel more comfortable so that when you show up at your goal race, at least you've done it before.
Right?
[00:29:43] Kevin: Like, this kinda reminded me of when the dog was a little puppy of trying to make sure that it had a, as much exposure to the environment around it as possible. Yeah. In small doses, right? Like it wasn't like, oh, you know, what we should do is expose it to all these things for hours and hours at a time.
Small little [00:30:00] doses of exposure and the puppy can adapt. If you've never done a race, if you're like, I've done a race, but they've always been small local races, I've never done like a bigger race, you're gonna want to make sure that you've got some familiarity with that. Otherwise, there's all sorts of things that can show up on like a big race weekend mm-hmm.
that you could, you could internalize and treat that as anxiety, stress inducing. Having some familiarity, some familiarity with the process. Just makes it a much smoother, smoother
[00:30:27] Angie: thing. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Unlike the, um, 18 hour car ride that I decided to bring the puppy on before we had really taken her in the car for, you know, an hour or more, less, more than an hour.
[00:30:38] Kevin: In theory, exposing the puppy to small doses of things. Yes. Well,
[00:30:42] Angie: and we did, like, we brought her, it's not like it was the first time in the car, but she,
[00:30:45] Kevin: she had
[00:30:45] Angie: seen the car before, but, well, but a lot of times the car, her car rides are like to the groomers and just like the very short car rides around town.
Yep. And then all of a sudden we took her to Ohio. Yeah. So that was, uh, an adjustment. It was
[00:30:59] Kevin: great. [00:31:00] Don't do that. It was fun for every person in the car. Yeah, exactly. Really. We all loved it.
[00:31:06] Angie: The next. Um, and then finally pacing for performance. Okay. So this is where we're gonna really talk, well, should we talk really about pacing?
I guess we already kind of addressed, you know, why or how you would pace yourself based on um, the goal for that tup
[00:31:19] Kevin: brace. Right. Cuz it depends like, are you practicing a pacing strategy? Yeah. Are you practicing a fueling strategy? There's a wide variety of different things. Mm-hmm. , and we'll talk in here about the different specifically Yeah.
Types of ways to pace a race. But just,
[00:31:32] Angie: um, one last note on that. If you're trying to test out a pacing strategy or if you're trying to test out a fueling strategy, just choose one. Yes. You know, don't try to do both. Okay. Like we said before, we had that client that her goal was fueling and then she ended up running a pr, which was fantastic, but that was not the goal.
So choose one goal for.
[00:31:54] Kevin: Tuneup race. Right? Because her pace was like, I want to be roughly near this pace, but she wasn't worried about it. Right? She had [00:32:00] a ballpark of roughly the pace that she wanted to hold, but the goal was making sure that she was fueling consistently
[00:32:04] Angie: through. Yeah. All right, so now let's talk about pacing for performance.
Actually racing a race, and the mistake that a lot of runners make here is that they don't have any pacing strategy. They just go out and they're like, I'm just gonna push myself as hard as I can for as long as I can. And that leads them to burnout out too soon oftentimes, or. Not, or maybe they hold themselves back and they don't reach their full potential.
Like, and some people can go that way more often. I would say that they burn out too quickly and then they don't have enough left in the tank for the end of the race. So those last miles, depending on how long your race is, can be very, very painful, right? Um, but for some runners, they end up going out too conservatively and they don't actually reach their full potential.
They probably could go a lot faster, but they went out too conservatively because they didn't really know what they were doing and didn't have a good strategy. So there's a couple different pacing strategies that [00:33:00] we wanna talk about today, and the first one is called positive splits. Now, positive splits are not a common commonly recommended pacing strategy, right?
It is very common for new runners to adopt this pacing strategy because like I said, they often just go out too hard in the beginning and then they end up getting slower over time. So, Positive splits means that you go out fast and then your pace slows down. Like positive, meaning the number gets bigger, the pace gets bigger, um, throughout the course of the race because you didn't do a very good job pacing yourself.
[00:33:36] Kevin: Right? So positive splits is different than I want to take out the, like the opening. 30 seconds minute of it so I can get out of this like big cluster of people and find my spot. Positive splits is I'm going to run as fast as I can until I can't anymore. Yeah. And then your pacing essentially just drops off
[00:33:51] Angie: a cliff.
Yeah. And then I'm just gonna try to hold on for dear life. Yes. You know, this is how the baseball players run our school 5k, right? Like this is what we see every single [00:34:00] year. The baseball players. They're gonna beat Mr. Brown. Mr. Brown, I'm gonna beat you this year. My, my goal you're not is just to beat you.
And then like, some of them like, oh, I'm just gonna beat you to the gate. And you're like, okay. Like fine. Like if you wanna sprint 200 yards to the gate, then go for it. But, um, that's what happens a lot of times is that they just, you just push too hard. They try to hold on for dear life and it doesn't usually end up going the way they want.
It's
[00:34:23] Kevin: also what happens when you tell small kids that you want them to run. Yeah. Like young kids have no concept of pacing. Mm-hmm. because they can't fathom the full distance of the race. Right. Which is why positive splits show up a lot with newer runners. They're not sure how tired they're gonna be in the third mile of a 5k.
Right. Because they've never experienced racing a 5k. If you haven't experienced racing a half marathon, you're not sure how tired you're going to be during that final, like the final 5K of the half marathon. So you are not quite sure. Maybe you take it out too fast cuz you think that you're gonna be able to, hold on, maybe you take it out too slow because you're like, no, no, no.
[00:35:00] I get really tired. I got really tired on my long run of 13. Mm-hmm. , if I'm racing it, I don't wanna push too fast at the beginning. The more experience you have racing, the less likely you are to positively split the race unless it's like caused by the course itself. Yes. Like if the course starts pretty strong downhill and finishes pretty strong uphill, you're gonna positive split that.
Like you're, there's just not a way around that thing.
[00:35:24] Angie: Yeah. So the course has a. You know, influence on positive splitting. So positive splitting is not a bad thing. It's just more, it's just not usually the, the, the goal for most people. Most people when they go out, they wanna either kind of maintain the same pace throughout the race or get faster as the race goes on.
Most people don't go out saying like, I wanna take out the race really, really fast in the beginning, and then I'm just gonna like get slower over time. That's, you know, a lot of times that's painful and miserable. Well, not only that, but it can be like a confidence killer as well. Yeah. Like when you are out there racing and you're trying to.[00:36:00]
Maintain a certain goal pace, and you just see that pace getting slower and slower with every mile. That can be a big confidence
[00:36:06] Kevin: killer. Yes. Yes. For which pretty much anybody that's run a a longer distance race will tell you, especially because the miles just keep coming and every time you hit another mile mark, it's slower than the one before.
It's, it's not a, and you're like excited, like,
[00:36:20] Angie: oh, and, and, and then you can feel how tired you are and you're like, wanna pick it up, but you're like, I just don't have it in me. And then there's like this whole internal battle with yourself. It's just, and like I said, Positive splits, like it does not always mean something negative.
It does not mean anything bad. It can definitely be caused by the course, especially on hilly
[00:36:40] Kevin: courses. It's often just caused by really long races though. Right. It's tough to, to, it's, it's hard erase a marathon. Right. It's tough period. To erase a half marathon. Yeah. And these are long things. Yeah. And trying to nail the pacing strategy gets tricky.
Right. Okay. The next concept we wanna talk about is even splits. Mm-hmm. . Okay. You did a great job of explaining this in the last one. It is [00:37:00] theoretically the fastest way to run a. In theory, you're using the same amount of energy. You never go too big. Like in theory, what's the best way to get good mileage in your car is on a highway.
No stops, no starts. You just hit that even pace and just cruise. That's in theory the fastest way to race, especially longer distances,
[00:37:21] Angie: right? This is just difficult to do, especially, especially when you don't have racing experience or especially when you don't have experience practicing a certain pace, because as you get tired, your effort level is naturally going to get higher.
So this is not like when we talk about even splits, we're not talking about effort level training, we're talking about the actual pace on your watch. And you guys know how much we love effort level training here at real life runners. We actually. Don't recommend a ton of training with specific paces. We recommend most of your training be done with effort level pacing, [00:38:00] but if you have a goal pace for a race, it is important for you to practice that pace because you have to know what that pace feels like in your body.
You also need to know the difference between that pace when you are fresh. Mm-hmm. at the beginning of the race and that pace towards the end of the race when you are more tired. Because just to maintain the same pace is going to feel much harder. So I remember when I was in, um, when I ran the Key West Half Marathon.
Yep. We went out and the whole, this whole day was like a total, you know, uh, storm. Storm, yes. I was gonna a literal show. Trying, trying not to curse here. Just storm, um, a blank show. Right. It was a, a total blank show. Yes. Because the race actually got pushed back by two hours because there was basically a tropical storm outside that came out of nowhere.
Um, and the palm trees were. Sideways. Like the wind was so strong, the palm trees were sideways. It was so crazy. If it wasn't
[00:38:54] Kevin: January, it would be a tropical storm. Yeah. You just can't technically have a tropical storm in January. You can't? No. Why not? Because [00:39:00] we're at a season, so it's not formed correctly.
So the wind doesn't ever make the circular path. And so it's not actually a tropical storm.
[00:39:05] Angie: Oh yeah. Yeah. Okay. How about that? So look, meteorologist Kevin just taught you guys something completely unrelated to running. Like meteorologist. Kevin teaches me things all the time, so. anyhow, so yes, it was in January, but we went out and my fueling strategy was all off like, oh yeah, you know, because I had eaten.
I woke up and I ate assuming that the race was gonna be on. Then the storm hits, then they postponed the race, then they postponed the race a second time. So it was just all wonky, all crazy. And so I was just like, you know what? I'm just gonna go out and I'm gonna do my best. I'm gonna like essentially abandon whatever my plan was.
Mm-hmm. . And I'm just gonna go out and run. I'm just going to run by effort. Like I was going to try to run a pacing, you know, strategy to run a PR at that race, but I was like, I'm just gonna go out and I'm gonna run by effort only. Yeah. And I ended up starting off much faster than I expected. . And so when I got to mile 10, [00:40:00] mile 9, 10, 11, my body was hurting.
You were exhausted. I was, I was hurting. And so I was like, just stick with these people. Just main, main, make sure that your pace doesn't go above nine minutes. You know? Cause I was like at that point, holding like an 8 50, 8 55. I'm like, just don't go above nine. You know, like, because I had built in like a, a buffer be because I did, um, go faster in the beginning of the race, which again is not usually recommended, but that's just the way it worked out.
We'll we'll get to why
[00:40:28] Kevin: that
[00:40:28] Angie: might be recommended. Yeah. Because it was effort level, not pace. Uhhuh, that I was focusing on. But anyway, um, yes. I don't know why I was going with this, but in theory, holding that, even pace throughout the race is, you know, ideal. I
[00:40:42] Kevin: mean, one of the top US men's marathoners, Jared Ward, has done like graduate research Yeah.
On this. Like he's got, I, I think he has a PhD at this point in time, but he's done a ton of research and at the last US Olympic trials, his opening half marathon and his second half [00:41:00] of the half marathon were within one second of each other. Oh. Oh, right. Which, that's how spot on it is. That's how much he believes in it.
So we're gonna talk
[00:41:07] Angie: about that in
[00:41:07] Kevin: a little bit here. Yeah. There are other times where even splits might not be the most ideal thing. Negative splits we've talked about. Okay. Negative splits are tricky, especially if you don't have a lot of experience in racing because people get you so excited at the start of races.
There's like a DJ there. Yeah. They're screaming into a microphone who's excited for the race. You're all pumped up. Your heart rate gets elevated. Mm-hmm. , and then they shoot off a gun and. You might take that opening mile a little faster than you would if someone just calmly walked up to you and said, you're going to run for the next two hours.
Start like that would be a very different pace than the music going and everybody cheering and the gun goes off and people start flying. It's either way, it's a half marathon, but one of 'em you're excited and you take off really, really fast. So the negative split, you have to counter all of that. Mm-hmm.
you have [00:42:00] to have all of this patience at the beginning to be like, I'm gonna take it out extra slow. And it's okay that people are pulling away from me and it's okay that I'm slower than the goal pace that I'm aiming for. Right. So if people pulling away from you and your watch beeping at you that you're off of pace is gonna cause a huge amount of stress to you now that's just, that's wasted energy on mental stress.
Mm-hmm. . So negative splitting is something that you've gotta practice repeatedly so that you can get comfortable with taking it out easy. Mm-hmm. and, and have that confidence that you'll be able to come back and charge strong towards the end of the race.
[00:42:34] Angie: Right. So, Point of negative splits and like starting off the race slower than your goal pace is to help conserve energy so that you have more left towards the middle and the end of the race.
Because the whole concept of negative splitting is starting out slower and then gradually getting faster as the race progresses. And in order to do that, like that, those beginning, that beginning chunk of the race helps you to just kind of like [00:43:00] conserve and then really push harder towards the.
[00:43:03] Kevin: Right.
And part of this is just such an awareness of like, how excited do you want to be for the race? Mm-hmm. , and I think this was one of a myriad of things that I got wrong when trying to race a hundred miles. I think that I was too excited at the start, and I'll be honest, I was not, I was doing my best to try to stay calm, but you know, there's some excitement to the start of it.
I'm pretty sure that that opening mile was a good minute and a half faster than the goal pace for the opening mile and you know that it's just one of the things that happened. It's gonna be okay. ,
[00:43:38] Angie: how do you think that that affected you with the rest of the race? So I think that because when you're thinking, so sorry to interrupt you.
Yeah. But when you're thinking about a hundred mile race that you're attempting here Yeah. You're like, oh, the first mile was too fast. And it's like, dude, you still have 99 miles to go. Like, so how did that , that first mile actually affect
[00:43:55] Kevin: it? Oh, because it's, it's a momentum thing. Mm-hmm. is, the first mile is so quick.
[00:44:00] So then I'm looking at, like, I, I wasn't actually looking at my watch at this point. But I know I'm like, I'm probably going a little bit too fast. I should start slowing down a little bit. But there's one thing to slow down when you're close to the pace, you're like, I just pull back just a little bit.
Mm-hmm. . So I tried to pull back a little bit, but then I needed to pull back a little bit more. If you take it out way too fast, it's hard to pull back enough to get to the pace that you actually want to go to. Mm-hmm. sometimes. Yeah. Okay. But it's actually kind of related to the next concept that I wanted to cover here.
Yeah. Which is what's kind of dub like the U curve of pacing. Mm-hmm. , which is honestly what you did at Key West. So this is
[00:44:37] Angie: an interesting one because this is a newer pacing strategy, right. I mean, I'm sure people have used it in the past. People naturally default to this actually. Right. But it's. Been talked about more recently?
Yes. Because like you said, there's been research done
[00:44:51] Kevin: on it. A lot of research on it. Yeah. Like an enormous amount of research where people are pulling in like marathon files and Strava files. Yeah. And doing like [00:45:00] massive metadata analysis.
[00:45:01] Angie: All right. So let's talk about what is the uur pacing
[00:45:03] Kevin: strategy?
Okay, so this study came out that they were tracking world records of like the 1500 and the the 3000, the 5,000, the 10,000, all of these like mid-distance races. Mm-hmm. , and it actually still works even with the marathon, that everybody takes it out a little bit quick. Mm-hmm. then falls into a pace that's roughly their goal pace and then finishes fast.
Yeah. And it happens. Every single world record that's been set in any sort of mid to longer distance race all has the exact same strategy. The fastest portion of every single, almost every single world record is the final kilometer of the 10 K. Mm-hmm. almost every single one. The only exception was the one that went out extra fast, that the first and the last kilometer were basically the same, but almost every single person's like, well, they, they take it out quick.
They hold onto a pace that they're pretty confident they can go with, which is what happened with [00:46:00] your Key West race. Right. You took it out quick. You were like, well, as long as I can keep 'em under nine. So it was, it wasn't like, you know, hanging on by your nails. Right. It was somewhat steady. and then you were able to kick at the end cuz you always kick Well most of
[00:46:15] Angie: it was more at like that eight 30 pace.
Yep. Cause like my, the beginning miles , like miles two and three, I ended up going through, kind of coming through in like an 8 0 8 and 8 0 9 pace. And I looked at my watch and I was like, oh shoot. Oh, Boise. Oh goodness. That's o that's early in the race to be seeing those numbers. Right. And so the, the pacing did get slower.
I'd actually be interested to go back and look at my pacing splits for that race. Yeah. Because I know that I ended up getting just slower throughout. I don't think that last mile was faster because, um, my calf was on the verge of Oh, that's right. Cramping remember. And I was like trying to push it, but my calf, like if I tried to go a little bit faster, it was a like two, you know, tenths of a hair away from just like, totally seizing up [00:47:00] on me.
Yeah.
[00:47:00] Kevin: You probably actually did not have a kick in that one because every time you tried to like extend the stride, it was like, oh, I'm
[00:47:05] Angie: gonna tighten on you. My calf was like, no, thank you. So yeah, so that's the goal is like, well this is actually. So is this actually the goal that people use, the strategy that people use now because of all of this research that has been
[00:47:19] Kevin: done on it?
Yeah. I think that this one is, it's remarkably close to even splitting. Yeah. Like even splitting in theory, you see the finish line and you're like, I mean, I should sprint, right? Because look at there faster, but I've got my even pace. That's not what anybody does. No. When you see the finish line, everybody's got a kick, right?
And you're like, uh, there's no way I'm gonna kick, I'm exhausted. You're at the back end of the marathon, you've got like a, you know, the quarter mile to go or the 10th of a mile and a half marathon, and you're like, uh, there's no way I could go faster than this. And you come around the turn and you see the finish line and suddenly you're going faster.
Yep. Some people are going, you can always find another gear. Right. Some people are going way faster. Mm-hmm. . But everybody's got a little bit more because if [00:48:00] you're chasing the clock, one second is still one more second Faster. Yeah. So everybody's gonna have that little bit extra that if you ask that person, can you pick up the pace?
A mile ago they didn't. Mm-hmm. it was physically not within them because your brain stops you from going faster. Right. Sooner than you possibly can, but as soon as you can actually see the finish line, it's not this like theoretical, how much further do I have? Mm-hmm. I have to get until I see that, until that sign mm-hmm.
like that's all I have to do. You know, there's a, a cross-country race that we run every year that the kids come down this hill mm-hmm. and they have to make like a big you and until they're actually facing the direction of the finish line. Mm-hmm. , it's tough to gauge how far you are. Mm-hmm. and I've told them all your one lap of the track from the finish line, but not all of 'em fully grasp what that is.
Yeah. Or some of 'em start to pick it up and then finally they come around the turn and they can see the finish line mm-hmm. and boom, suddenly the jets are just flying
[00:48:54] Angie: on this one. Right. Right. So if you wanted to use the Uur strategy Yep. How would you [00:49:00] break up your, like, the miles of the race? Like is there a certain percentage when you say you start quick?
Like are, do you mean that opening, the opening third, the opening 10th of the race, like op 20, the first 20% of the race? Like how do you know, like what is, like what percentage you kind of break it
[00:49:15] Kevin: down. I, I think it differs by what distance it is. Yeah. and the whole idea of taking it out quick. If, if you're running like a marathon, a half marathon, taking it out quick does not mean I'm on 5K pace.
Right? Like, you do not have to be that quick. But the Uur is a great idea to be like, I wanna make sure that I get out. I'm comfortable. I've got some like clearance of the people around me. Especially if the, if the race gets big and crowded, pushing for the opening half mile kilometer mm-hmm. like something to the, the first few minutes.
Right. Of a half marathon.
[00:49:50] Angie: A marathon. Right. And so we're not talking about sprinting, but I, I think it's basically like, just allow yours, allowing yourself to go with the adrenaline that you're feeling at the start of a race. Yep. Right. So it's [00:50:00] not like you're going out and you're trying to sprint and you're trying to like get around people.
Like, I mean, maybe there's a little bit of that, but. It's really just going out and kind of letting that adrenaline take over so that you're not fighting it as much. Yes. Because sometimes if you're going out and like you have all of this adrenaline, you know, pumping throughout your body and your, your body wants to go faster and you're consciously pulling yourself back, that can actually be more tiring than just allowing yourself to go with the
[00:50:26] Kevin: flow.
Yeah, very much so. Unless you've really practiced pulling yourself back. Mm-hmm. like we talked about during the negative splits. Yeah, exactly.
[00:50:33] Angie: Right. All right. Anything else on the uur?
[00:50:35] Kevin: No, I think that kind of covers uur. moving on. Okay. Chasing times versus racing other people. Okay. Using
[00:50:43] Angie: this as a pacing strategy?
[00:50:44] Kevin: Yes. Okay. And the differences of, of pacing strategies that might be best served for you if you're racing the clock versus if you're racing other people around you. Mm-hmm. and most people listen when they get into races are probably, let's be honest, chasing [00:51:00] the number on the clock. Right. Chasing the number on their wrist, like whatever it is, they probably have a time in mind mm-hmm.
and maybe they're keying in on other people around them. Uh, you know, especially in the middle part of the race where you're like, you are slowing down, so you're like, well, if I can just keep up with the guy in the red shirt of the girl in the, you know what, the girl in the yellow skirt? The girl in the skirt.
Yep. Yep. Like whoever, it's, she pulled me to my 10 K. There you go. Yep. Whoever you're trying to follow, that's, that's just using other people to try to maintain. Keeping up with the clock. Yeah. When I say racing others, I mean, the distance of the race is irrelevant. You're just actually trying to beat another person.
at this point, time doesn't matter. Like I've used these strategies in like our school 5k. Yep. I've run really dumb pacing strategies. . Right. But I've
[00:51:48] Angie: won the race. Because you're just racing
[00:51:49] Kevin: another person. Yeah, because like I am, I'm, I like to chat with people in the opening like mile or so of a 5K and try and feel out how this is gonna go with them.
Mm-hmm. , I did the [00:52:00] same thing in the Key West Half Marathon. There was a few of us, I asked the names of the other people around, I asked what the guy was shooting for and he told me how fast he was aiming for. That was a bad choice on his part. He should not have told me what he was aiming for because I knew if I took it 20 seconds faster for the next mile, that he was immediately gonna disappear because it was too fast for him to be going.
Mm-hmm. . And it was not so fast that I couldn't recover from it. Mm-hmm. . So it was the best idea to throw a random surge in at mile three and a half marathon. No, that was not gonna lead me the fastest time, but my goal was winning. Mm-hmm. , you know, I've done a 5K where these like high school kids try and, and beat me, but that 5k around our school, I don't even know how many times I've run that loop.
Yeah. But countless times I've run that loop, so I know exactly where every little split is. So I threw just an all out quarter mile in the middle of the race. This guy had no idea what was coming. Mm-hmm. . And he didn't know why I was doing it. He [00:53:00] was confused and so he simply gave up. He didn't try to go with me.
Yeah. And so when it made a 90 degree turn and I disappeared for him, He didn't know that I took a walking break to catch my breath. He thought that I had just blown his doors off and that he didn't have a chance of catching back up.
[00:53:15] Angie: Yeah. And I think this is a very interesting way to run a race that most recreational runners have not really thought about.
Yep. Because we've thought, we talk all the time about how wonderful the running community is and how supportive it is and how we're all there just encouraging other people and running this race and you know, there are other people around you, especially in longer races. Yeah. You kind of get to know them sometimes, like, oh yeah, you, you, you talk to them a little bit, you encourage them along, they start walking.
You're like, come on, let's go, let's go, let's go. Let's go do this together. And that's such a beautiful thing about the running community. So a lot of recreational runners I don't think have experienced racing like this . And so what is the benefit? So you obviously fine. Okay. Hold on. So you. Your goal when you [00:54:00] enter a race many times is to try to win the race.
Yes. Right? Like, and so for most of us that have no chance of winning a race, why would we use this pace? Age
[00:54:10] Kevin: strategy? I ask you that question. Yeah. Like that? No, I, I turn the question back to you is, I'm not entirely sure what the benefit of this is outside of pure fun.
[00:54:19] Angie: Okay. So first, okay, so let's just talk about this, um, for people.
Let's address people that are actually trying to win the race. Sure. Because we do have some of those, like we have some people in our training academy that like do go out and try to win local races, right? Yep. Um, or even winning an age group, I think too. Yep. I think this is another good strategy to use if you're trying to get on the podium.
There are a lot of people that go out and run their local races and they love, you know, getting on the podium for local races. Of course. And you guys know, just like we were talking about Speedo man, earlier in the episode, there are people that show up at the races that you know, that you at least recognize and you're like, that girl always wins first place.[00:55:00]
That girl always wins third place, you know, like, or whatever it might be. I wanna beat that girl today. So this would be a great strategy to use if you want to actually, um, you know, get on the podium in a race.
[00:55:14] Kevin: Right? So this is when you have to go through all these different pacing strategies. Mm-hmm. is positive splitting gonna be the best thing for you?
Like maybe, right? Yeah,
[00:55:23] Angie: maybe it
[00:55:23] Kevin: would be. , I could, I could positive split a 5K and probably beat a lot of people. Mm-hmm. , even if they could outrace me in a 5k, because a lot of people, if they're training for a 5k, don't have the volume of training that I have. Yeah. Like my mileage per week is higher than a lot of other recreational runners in the area that are training to run a 5K every, you know, every month.
Right. They're gonna race a 5k. Great. I can probably beat that guy simply by taking the opening mile out so fast. That they're gonna be like, well that guy's gone. Mm-hmm. and they will, they will stop trying to catch up. Yeah. There are other people where you [00:56:00] take them outta the game. Mentally I take them outta the game mentally.
Right. There are other people where it's like, okay, that guy can probably beat me, so if I can try to slow the pace down as much as possible. Mm-hmm. , which is what I did in college. CrossCountry. Mm-hmm. . There was another guy, we were both seniors running intermural, CrossCountry, also training for the Chicago Marathon.
Mm-hmm. and in the, the last race of the like CrossCountry series, at one point I got in front of him and slowed the pace down so much that the two of us were just jogging because he would just let me just control the pace the entire time. Mm-hmm. , he knew he had a better kick than I. . He knew that if the two of us came around the final turn, shoulder to shoulder, he was going to out kick me and there was nothing I could do to stop him.
Mm-hmm. , he just had better high end speed than I did. And so I got it to a point where it was like, all right, if I'm gonna control the pace, we're going to be running eight minute pace through this. And we were used to running like 5 20, 5 30 Pace Uhhuh . But so starting at a mile and a half into the [00:57:00] 5k, I was like, yep, and the pace is gonna be back at seven and now it's at seven 30.
And he was tripping over his own feet because he couldn't, he couldn't control himself back and he refused to take the lead. He refused to take the lead. So I just kept making it slower and slower until he would take the lead. He finally took the lead and I tucked in right on his shoulder, and now I'm breathing hard on his shoulder.
He hates leading races. He just hates doing it because all you can do is hear a guy breathing on your shoulder. So now I'm like purposely panting on the guy's shoulder.
[00:57:33] Angie: And at this point you guys are all seeing the dark side of Kevin now , everyone thinks Kevin's so nice. I like
[00:57:39] Kevin: racing. They're, it's fun.
Um, and I love, I love teaching the kids on our cross Kendra team good racing strategies. It's fun.
[00:57:46] Angie: It's fun when they get to that point, you know? Cuz you can't teach 'em that stuff too early. No. It's like later in their running career when you start to teach them this and then they have so much fun with it.
[00:57:54] Kevin: At first you gotta just make sure people can complete a 5K and complete a 5K faster and then you can start some of these [00:58:00] strategies. Mm-hmm. . But when you're in second place, You are the person who gets to decide when you're making the move and the person in front of you knows at some point it's coming, but they don't know when.
Yeah. Maybe they think that they're in charge, but if you're sitting in second place knowing to yourself, when we pass that tree, I'm gonna go and this guy has no idea it's coming. And that's exactly what happened. We're, it's like, it's like a little secret you have, right. I knew a secret and he didn't know.
He probably had a guess. Yeah. That this was the plan, that at some point I was just gonna shoot past him and grind it to the finish line and hope that he had no more kick Uhhuh . And turned out the answer was it was around a half mile, cuz there was like, there was a spot on the chorus where it was a sharp left, another sharp left, and we made the first turn and I just.
all out as hard as I could go. And I knew I couldn't hang on to that place all the way to the finish, but it was gonna be, I'm going all out right now, so if you would like to still be here and try and out kick me, you better go now. Mm-hmm. . And [00:59:00] he was like, O okay, I guess you're going now. Mm-hmm. . I saw him at the finish line.
Yeah.
[00:59:04] Angie: So that's, yeah. I mean, and that sounds really fun to do that. It's fun, boy, it's fun. Like, and I, I think that that's one of the things that it needs to fun stories. Both of you had the goal of winning. Yes. So someone in like the middle of the pack or the back of the pack, using that strategy, if you're like, huh, I'm gonna outrace this person, that person doesn't know they're racing you
Right? Like then it's like, does it, is it really as fun? Does it really work? You know? Do you see what I'm
[00:59:29] Kevin: saying? Well, this is where finding people that you raced against repetitively. Yeah. Where you talk about like in your local community. Yeah. And you're like, okay, well that person and I are often battling each other for who gets on the age group podium.
Mm-hmm. , that person and I are often battling for fastest female, fastest masters. Mm-hmm. , like whatever the category is. Maybe you recognize this person, then I think you can directly race them. Yeah. There may be hundreds of people in the race. Mm-hmm. . But as far as you're concerned, there's two, maybe there's three, right?
And you guys can race [01:00:00] each other because you recognize each other. When you start that familiarity, then racing
[01:00:03] Angie: comes up. I think that you can also just pick a random person that you're going to. Decide that you're gonna keep up with or try to race. Yep. And then you can kind of see how people react in the race also.
Cause there are definitely, like, especially as a girl, like when you pass a guy, guys don't always like that. Like some, some guys don't care, right? Right. But then there's those always those guys that like wanna keep up with you or you pass them and now they. It's their job to then pass you right back. Of course.
That's right. They don't wanna let you too far ahead of them. So someone like that might be,
[01:00:35] Kevin: now, you know, you're racing that person right then. Yeah. If you pass, you kind of find those people. If you pass a guy Yeah. And he's immediately back up on your shoulder, now you're in a race with that person.
Mm-hmm.
[01:00:45] Angie: or like, say he passes me, then I can kind of tuck behind him and do the thing that you were talking about and then try to beat him at the edge.
[01:00:51] Kevin: Interest. It's fun to play and it doesn't always work out Right. But sometimes you lose the races. Like there were three cross-country races and I did not win all the [01:01:00] cross-country races, but I learned about this guy in the first race, and I employed the strategy in the third one.
Mm-hmm. , I, I can't remember how the second one went. Um, I, I think he may have won the first two and then I got him on the third one. Mm-hmm. . But you, you learn some things and you just have a blast doing it. Yeah. Like, this is the other thing is it takes the, the racing for competition. The racing for pr, and connects it back to the first strategy.
it can still be fun. Racing can still be fun if you, if you win the race, if you lose the race, if you get out kicked at the race, if you hit the pr, if you don't because you're trying new things and racing itself can just be a fun experience. Yeah, I
[01:01:37] Angie: think that's, that's it is really just tapping into that competitive spirit.
Yeah. Because you don't have to be racing the clock every single time. And I think that we as recreational runners get so bogged down in those numbers. Mm-hmm. in the clock. Not being as fast as we were a year ago or whatever it might be, that going in with a fresh [01:02:00] perspective might bring some more fun and more joy into the running or the racing
[01:02:04] Kevin: experience.
Yeah. I mean, you, like, you love tapping into curiosity. Yeah. Nothing is quite as curious as what if I raised this person that I've never seen before in my life. , I don't know. I, I have no idea how fast that person is. So it makes it interesting. Right? And then
[01:02:17] Angie: maybe in the middle of that race, that person kind of falls off and you're like, okay, that person's gone.
Let me pick a new person to race. Exactly right. So it doesn't have to always be the same person that you're racing, that you can pick and choose different people throughout the race to, uh, just become your. Secret competitors.
[01:02:34] Kevin: Yeah. , there's, there's a lot of different pacing strategies. Yeah. And they can be fun to try different things and see, see what you like.
You know, it also connects back to the, the practice races. Mm-hmm. try these different strategies, which one feels the most comfortable? And just because something feels comfortable when you race a 5k, doing it does not mean that's the same strategy that's gonna feel most comfortable doing a half marathon.
[01:02:55] Angie: Totally. Well, and I think that this also does not take [01:03:00] away from that spirit of the running community. Like we were talking about, how we all support each other. Because one of my favorite things to see when I watch elite races mm-hmm. When I watch the professionals race or when I watch the Olympics, is these guys and girls are racing all out.
Like they all want that gold medal. And at the end they, they congratulate each other, they hug each other, they're sweaty, hugging, they're right. Genuinely happy for the other person. Like they might be disappointed in themselves, they might be disappointed in their performance, but oftentimes they are genuinely happy for that other person, especially if it's, you know, someone from the same country.
Yeah, of course. You know, they can all celebrate each other. So we can be competitive with each other. We can pick these people to race so that we're not always racing the clock and still be happy for them at the end. Also, because who knows, maybe you pull them to a pr. Yep. You know, like, I know I've had friends like that where my goal has been like just to keep up with my friends and then it became, okay, well what if I could actually beat [01:04:00] this person and it's caused me to end up running a PR race.
Yep. Because, and, and it's not because I wanna. Better than them or anything like that. It's just like, okay, like it's just one more thing, one more strategy you can use to help push yourself to a level that you might not get to otherwise.
[01:04:17] Kevin: Yeah, no, I mean that's, that's a great way to
[01:04:18] Angie: push yourself. Yeah. All right, you guys.
So that's what we have for you today. So we hope that you found this episode helpful and we would love to know what pacing strategy you are using in your next race. Okay. So head over to real life runners on Instagram and send me a DM and let me, And what pacing strategy you plan on using for your next race.
So as always, thank you so much for listening. Thank you for sharing the show. Thank you to all of you that have written us a review or left a rating on iTunes or a star rating on Spotify. We really appreciate it and that helps us to reach new people every week and spread the running love.
Thank you for being here with us today. This has been the real life runners podcast, episode number [01:05:00] 298. Now get out there and run your life.
